Stephanie Landis

Welcome. We are very excited today to have Pat Sorells from Camp For All here, chatting with us about summer camps and camp life for students of all abilities. So welcome. Thank you. It’s nice to be here. Y’all are nice to have me too. Well, we are excited because Camp For All is near and dear to our hearts. Before we started recording, Meredith and I were just sharing our own stories from being at Camp For All and how they impacted us. And that’s not even how they impacted the students. So it’s amazing that a place like Camp For All has such a positive impact on everyone. So thank you for coming and chatting with us.

Pat Sorrell

Thank you. It’s going to be a great conversation.

Stephanie Landis

Yeah. So you are the president and CEO. How did you get started and involved with Camp For All?

Pat Sorrell

I was one of our partners. So the Parish School is one of our partners and we collaborate with more than 65 different partners. And I was with the Periwinkle Foundation for 10 years. And that was after I was the development director here at the Parish School. And so, which led me to my nonprofit life, by the way. But I was at the Periwinkle Foundation for 10 years as their executive director. And then their founder and camp for all founder is one and the same, Dr. Paul Gerson. And he said, “Pat, I want you to come over to Camp For All.” And I said, “No.” And he said, “Come talk to us.” And so I went to talk to them and I went, “Oh my gosh, I could use more of my skills, my background and everything for more students, more kids, more adults with special needs and challenging illnesses.” And it just, I said, “Absolutely, yes.” Yeah.

Stephanie Landis

Well, Camp For All, I love the name, but can you describe its mission?

Pat Sorrell

Camp for All transforms the world for children and adults with challenging illnesses, disabilities, and special needs. Yeah. And they truly are a camp for all. We are a camp for all. It was designed from the very beginning to be for all. So they brought in Peter Boudreau with Curry Boudreau Architects years ago now and said, “We want you to design this camp.” And Paul had already started Camp Periwinkle and Dr. Bob Zeller had started a camp for children with epilepsy called Spike and Wave and they couldn’t take kids except for one week in the summer at a regular camp. And they couldn’t take kids in wheelchairs. They couldn’t take lots of challenges. So they got together with Larry Nyhouse who had lost his son Beau to cancer and the three of them are our founders. And so they called him Peter Boudreau, who was basically just starting out and said, “Will you design this camp for us?” And Paul told him it would be the thing he was most proud of in the long run.

And Peter said, “Sure, I’ll design it. ” But what he did is he talked to our potential partners of all challenges, epilepsy, Texas Children’s Hospital, Cerebral Palsy, you name it. He talked to adult camps, the camp serving adults with special needs and cognitive challenges or brain injuries. He said, “What do you need in a camp that would really change and help the lives of the people you serve?” And he then designed the camp and he got back together with them after that, after he did the design and said, “Okay, what do you think? ” And they gave him more feedback. So Peter listened and that is why our camp is designed on a 900 foot radius so people with mobile challenges or wheelchairs or whatever can get to all the activities easily. And y’all know we take a wagon out to the ranch, which is a little further and it’s barrier free.

All the bathrooms are accessible, not one stall, all of them, all the doors, all the showers, big enough to have a caregiver in there with you even. And even our dietary issue, we can meet any kind of dietary issue there is. And Peter didn’t design the food, but he designed the kitchen. And that is why we are truly barrier free and we’re the only truly barrier free camp in the country. Concrete sidewalks, eight feet wide, so two people in wheelchairs or with mobile issues can go side by side. Even our nature trail is concrete, but that’s why we are camp for all.

Meredith Krimmel

It’s amazing. It’s not just the physical campus that is barrier free and a camp for all. It’s also the way you run your programming and the flexibility. Can you talk a little bit about your counselors and your activities and how that works for campers of all abilities?

Pat Sorrell

Our staff is trained, professionally trained to run all the activities and all the activities are designed for multiple challenges to be able to accomplish those activities. So we can get anybody up a zip line out of their wheelchair and they can go flying free down the zip line. Archery, there’s ways to do archery for those that can’t hold a bow so everybody can accomplish it. One of my favorite pictures is this little girl. She’s beautiful. She has no arms and she is using her feet to shoot the bow and arrow. And the grin on her face is huge. And this is why it’s so important to be able to do, to provide this kind of activities and things like that. The activities, the food, everything. They come to camp for all and they realize, well, research has shown, to be honest, from Texas A&M to a three year study, they found out that the kids left with a sense of hope, a growth in self-confidence, and because they were surrounded by other kiddos with the same challenges, they realized they weren’t alone.

That’s huge in the lives of these people. And we have campers and campers that have come to camp like one … I’m going to tell one story as this little boy came with cancer. He was playing baseball totally normal, and then he was diagnosed with cancer. And his mom couldn’t play baseball. He couldn’t do things with his brothers. He couldn’t do the things he normally used to do. And his doctor said, “I want you to go to Camp Perrywinkle. I want you to go to camp for all. ” And he said, “No.” He said, “I can’t do anything anymore.” He got a huge chip on his shoulder. So she convinced him, the doctor convinced him to come to camp and he came and the first thing he said was, his counselor said, “Well, let’s go to the dance.” He said, “I can’t go to the dance.” And his counselor said, “Well, why?” And he takes off his hat and of course he doesn’t have any hair because of his chemotherapy.

He said, “This is why.” And his counselor said, “Look around you. Look at all these other kids, look at all your cabin mates that have the same issue, or maybe they’re worse off. Maybe they have more challenges.” And he couldn’t swim because of his central line, but we were able to do things that he could participate at the pool and everything. He left camp with the biggest grin on his face. It was ear to ear. And his mom called after camp and said, “Thank you for sending home a different

Meredith Krimmel

Child.” Yeah, you live your life with all these limitations. “No, you can’t do this. You can’t do that. “It’s just an amazing experience to go and be able to do something that just feels so normal and that maybe you’ve never had a chance to do, or maybe something you used to do and now you can’t do anymore. And to be able to provide just a week of normalcy, like a normal childhood, a normal experience is amazing.

Pat Sorrell

I think it helps them in the rest of their lives. I mean, so many of our campers that are now adults that made it through life, because we’ve had campers come that only have a few weeks to live, but they’ve made it through life and they’re not defined by their challenge. Angela Rigglesworth, for instance, she’s been in a wheelchair her entire life. She won teacher of the year at her school, and she’s Ms. Wheelchair, Texas. I was talking to one of my best friends the other day and she said,” I went to my grandson’s school and this wonderful teacher was … She was in a wheelchair. “I said,” Is it Angela Rigglesworth? “She said,” Yes, how’d you know? “I said,” Because she’s a former camper. “And she’s also a former board member and staffer. We love her obviously, but I have so many of these stories of the … What happens at camp stays with them the rest of their lives, even if they’re only there for a weekend or a week.

And so we always try and have something they can do to take home with them, whether it’s something from arts and crafts so they can remember that week or the recording studio where they can record their own songs. Love

Stephanie Landis

The recording studio.

Pat Sorrell

That is the funniest thing to watch. It is absolutely hysterical and I love to give a tour and have something going on in there, but giving them something so they can remember that week or that weekend is really meaningful to them for the rest of their lives, even if they don’t come back to camp.

Stephanie Landis

Yeah. And I am from Ohio. Moving down to Texas, summer camp culture is something that … I mean, I had friends that went to camp, but not like people down here in Texas go to camp. And so I’m sure that that’s also another way that these kids are going to camp and they’re making lifelong friends and they might be watching their siblings, like you said, or other friends go have these camp experiences and feel like their childhood is even more different than from that. But now they get to go and have a place where they have summer camp and they have that camp culture and the s’mores and the canoeing and the rock wall climbing and the friendships that are forming from children who they get to meet in that camp setting because when you are away from your parents and you get to go be independent, that independence is huge and you form different friendships, but also that sense of accomplishment that our kids get when they thought that they couldn’t be away from their parents, even when ours go there with us, with their teachers, but that might be their first time that they’re ever away from their full-time caregiver of a parent.

And it is so hard for the parents to let go. And as a parent, I completely get it, but the kids just feel so proud and accomplished and they have that sense of independence that I’m sure is especially hard for children who are not used to having that.

Pat Sorrell

Yes. I mean, it’s amazing. You talk about a regular summer camp and I went to camp. I went to camp Minnesota. I grew up in Houston, but I went to Minnesota. Who knew? But my mom would say when we got off the bus when we got home, she said,” We all look taller. “I think we were walking taller and for kiddos that have educational learning challenges and things like that, I think camp is a place where they can excel and make friends easier and that type of thing. And so they can approach other things having that growth and self-confidence. I think it’s important.

Stephanie Landis

For sure. One of the things that Meredith kind of alluded to is one of my favorite things of Camp for All is the challenge by choice. And we have so many kids that sometimes it might have some sensory or physical or other limitations that make things like the rock wall or the giant swing or even canoeing feel really hard. And when we have that and the counselors are the same way, they’re like, ” Challenge by choice, go up as far as you want, come back down, go here. “Last year, I personally am terrified of the giant swing. I don’t do well with swinging motions. The older I’ve got, the worse I’ve gotten with it. And I’m here with one of my campers and I’m like, ” Challenge by choice. You can do it. Let’s just get up in the giant swing and you can hang in the harness.

You don’t even have to swing or get pulled up. If you’re really feeling crazy, we’ll just swing your feet back and forth. “He is a kid who loves having both feet on the ground. Sturdy movement is hard for him anyway. He did it. He went up there, he felt so accomplished. We go back the next year and he’s like, ” Okay, I can do this. I got it. “And then he looks at me and he’s like, ” But if I’m going to do it, you’re going to do it. “I was like, ” What?

“And then in the moment I was like, ” Oh my gosh, now I have to face my own challenge and fear. “And I was like, ” Okay, if you do it and you swing your feet, I will get up there. “And man, they are right. It still terrified me and they could probably hear me screaming miles away, but I felt so accomplished and all of the kids were proud of me. And I was like, ” Oh my gosh, this is what they feel.

Meredith Krimmel

“Feels amazing. It

Stephanie Landis

Feels amazing. And I don’t think that if he would have been in a different situation where he felt forced and pressured to have to go do an activity or where they had what might have been like, ” Well, everybody else is doing it, or approaching it in a different way of like, you get to choose how hard you want to go. We’re here to get whatever capability. “I don’t think he would have gotten on there and then I know he wouldn’t have then felt confident enough to challenge me and I wouldn’t have gone on there. So just the whole challenge by choice, it’s an amazing … It’s freeing.

Pat Sorrell

It is. And it’s also known as the giant scream.

Stephanie Landis

That was me.

Pat Sorrell

But it reminded me of two stories. And one, not only does the kids have a choice of how high they go coming back again, they can next time move forward or the next day move up and forward. But recently we were out on the climbing wall and one of the other campers put his arm around the fellow camper and said,” You can do this. I’m here for you.

“That was huge. But then also out at the ranch, we had our ranch manager is wonderful and does a great job working with the kids, as does all of our staff. And there was a little boy with autism that came out and he didn’t want to have anything to do with it. So Mike, he just made friends with that one boy and said,” Okay, just today, let’s take one … We don’t want to pet the horse. “And so he petted the horse. He came back the next time and he wanted to do more. And so Mike just let him guide him and next thing we know, he was riding the horse. It was a big deal.

Meredith Krimmel

It is. Small steps to reach big goals.

Pat Sorrell

Yes.

Meredith Krimmel

One of the things I think makes camp for also unique and special, and you kind of talked about this, how you’re a partner camp. So can you explain what that means, a partner camp?

Pat Sorrell

So we, as I said, collaborate with about 65 different nonprofits. And what that means is our partners, the parish school, Texas Children’s Hospital, the Epilepsy Foundation, they sign up the campers. They have all the HIPAA and the medical information. They bring the doctors, nurses, medicines. They are in charge of whatever challenge comes out. They are in charge of making sure those kids are well taken care of and safe. And they bring the in cabin counselors and they pay half the fee for everybody to come out. Camp for all provides the barrier free site, the professional staff to run all the activities, all the activities that are being able to be accomplished by whatever the challenge is. Dietary issues, we meet them all, as I said. Our record is 63 different special diets for a week for three meals a day.

And then we provide the other half of the cost, and they’re family camps. So our partners decide what kind of camp it’s going to be, and it might be a family camp where they … Families that have a child with a challenge, that’s their family camp, or it could be a family camp that has a child with cancer. There’s a family camp for families that have children with really bad food allergies. And I mean, they’re small, they’re intimate, they’re wonderful. But again, those families get a chance to see each other, share resources and things like that. But the camps that have adults or children with really severe challenges, think of those parents getting that time off. So their kids are at camp. And I know it’s maybe hard for those families to send them the first time.

In fact, one family would not leave. Their son, he had multiple challenges and they were afraid to leave him. They’d never left him before. And so we kind of took them aside and we’re kind of showing them all about Camp for All and they come back in and he’s singing karaoke and they said,” I guess we can go home. “They said it saved their marriage.

So these are all ways, this is how the partnership works. Together we move things forward for the campers and take the best care of them. We’re one of four camps in the country that have this business model, but it works well because for our partners, it’s less expensive because we’re picking up half the cost.

Stephanie Landis

Where are the other camps located?

Pat Sorrell

There’s one in Port Aransas called Camp Aranza Zoo. There’s one outside of Dallas called Camp John Mark and there’s one in Georgia called, it’s the oldest, called Camp Twin Lakes. And now there are other special needs camps all over the country, but these are the only ones with this business model. And our founders made this decision and I really, I think it was the wisest thing they could have done.

Stephanie Landis

Yeah. That’s fantastic. I just ask because we have listeners from all over and they’re probably getting jealous and want to come to camp for all, which come on down to Texas, but it might be financially difficult. So it’s great news that there are similar camps around the country that maybe they can now start feeling like, oh, okay, I’m hearing about these life changing changes. Maybe this is a little nudge to start looking for my own child for something in our area too, or to find a partner down in Texas and try and come down to camp for all.

Pat Sorrell

Some of our partners are national. So we serve campers all over Texas and draw nationally like muscular dystrophy. That’s a national organization. So you can go on our website, campforall.org, and you can go find a camp and you can look and put in whatever the challenge is and you can see if there’s one of our partners that you can apply through. And some of them bring the kids in. I mean, we’ve had kids come from England and Mexico and everything. So our partners really work at serving who needs the best care.

Meredith Krimmel

One of the things I love about the partner model is when I … I go every summer for a week for our camp social that we host there. And it was always explained to me, you’re the expert in your kids and we’re the expert in the activities and we partner together to give the kids this best amazing week of camp. And that’s really what it feels like. They know the activities, they know how to adjust activities and keep our kids safe and keep our kids confident. And we know our kids so we can work with them, maybe try this strategy or maybe talk to them in this way. And I feel like that works really well, especially with the kids that we serve who have communication. So we can kind of educate your staff who are always so willing and happy to learn and support us while we support them.

Pat Sorrell

So my two sons came to the parish school and they … Camp was not around when they were in school, but they’ve both been counselors at camp. And they individually, they came home and said,” Mom, I just didn’t get it before. “And they kept going back. They volunteered for other camps and things like that because they saw the impact of it and the impact of this school is incredible too, by the way.

Meredith Krimmel

We think it’s pretty incredible.

Stephanie Landis

But it does give that extra … When you can have these partnership schools, one of the great things is that we were just talking before we recorded about how my children are now at the age where with their school, they go for overnight camp for one night or maybe three or four nights. And again, going back to that, being able to offer to our children, because we are a specialized population here, the opportunity to be like, ” I go to overnight camp too, “and they’re at a place where they can go and they’re safe and challenged and have that experience, it’s just amazing to be another way that you can give the kids a well-rounded overall experience.

Pat Sorrell

It’s so important because they go back to school and they have that self-confidence that they can be a part of the crowd and they’re not different. The Tourette’s syndrome group came to camp and this little girl was at the carnival and she wanted to participate, but she didn’t know how to do it. She didn’t know how to approach it. And so they talked to her, they said,” Well, do you have any friends here? “She said,” No, no. “So we worked with her and helped her realize that here’s how you can reach out and she learned how to make friends because when you have Tourette’s, I mean, people avoid you or they’re not comfortable or they don’t want to make you uncomfortable. It’s tough. It really is. But if you have an opportunity to learn these things in a safe environment, it does impact you for the rest of your life.

And these kids here at the parish school, to be able to have this opportunity to go out there and do that and come home and feel that self-confidence that y’all build on every day and then it builds on coming to camp too.

Stephanie Landis

We get to see their executive functioning skills in action when you throw them in a whole new situation.

Meredith Krimmel

With a bag and all their stuff packed and organizing their shower routine, you really get to see a very different side of a child at camp.

Stephanie Landis

And going through the food line and having to clean up the table and it is just eye opening and we really get to see a whole different side and they get to experience a whole different side of them that it’s like, ” No, it’s on you, bud. You got to clean it up. Yeah, you can eat whatever you want. Yes, you can go do this. “And seeing them in that different way helps us then also expand our ability to help go like, ” Oh, this is where they need some more support and here’s some strategies they can use in this way. “And it just gets us a different side of the kids.

Pat Sorrell

So I have parish school stories too, but I love one of my favorites is the food line that you mentioned and the pragmatics of going through the food line. I mean, that’s huge. And I’ve been there and watched them and see them solve that problem and how do I go through the food line? I mean, it’s a simple thing that makes an impact on them. So I think it’s, yeah, it’s tremendous. This is why, again, the business model works so well because we know your goals for your campers before you come to camp. And so the whole design of the schedule and everything is based on how are we going to achieve these goals. And our program supervisors are, their experience and education is all dedicated to that achievement and making sure it’s going to work and have the impact it’s supposed to have.

Stephanie Landis

One of my other favorite parts is that every year the kids do skits

And we are a very drama focused school, but having them do and kind of take ownership of their own little skits, especially because traditionally camp skits are usually like funny or silly and they usually have some sort of joke and it’s either a word play based joke or a social situational joke and these are all areas of their language skills that are hard for them. And as an SLP, I’m like, yes. We spend like three weeks just focusing on humor around skits and camp skits. And these kids don’t even realize that they’re getting all of this underlying therapy

Because they’re so excited to go perform skits at Camp For All and watch the other kids do these skits that they’re just like so bought in and it makes my job as a therapist so much easier because they’re already into it and they have an end goal that they’re really looking forward to and have ownership of. And it is also one of my favorite parts because these skits are just hilarious and our kids just shine when they have that opportunity to get in front of the campfire in front of their friends and just go out there and have a ball doing these skits. And it’s hilarious.

Pat Sorrell

Okay. I haven’t seen them, but now I’m going to go

Stephanie Landis

See them. I think I have a few recorded. Maybe I’ll send some to you because they are so funny.

Meredith Krimmel

And the kids love them. I mean, everybody loves them. The counselors love them and it’s always fun.

Pat Sorrell

Well, and that’s creativity. I mean, it’s things putting them on stage and having them project. I mean, that’s awesome.

Stephanie Landis

And it’s similar because like I said, my son went to Boy Scout camp and the Boy Scouts do campskits. And then one of the other boys in our group like two or three years ago was also a Boy Scout and he was like, “Oh, I’ve gone to an overnight boy scout camp. I can help take charge.” And usually he wasn’t a kid that was a leader and he was like, “I know skits.” And he jumped right in and took charge of trying to help the kids come up with a skit. And he was like, “We’ve done this skit. We’ve done that skit.” And he got to like own some leadership in a new way where in the classroom he usually kind of shied away because he was a little more self-conscious about where he was academically or other things. And in this side, he got to shine.

Pat Sorrell

I have seen so many campers that come that are quiet and shy and they’re literally, when they leave, they’re holding on the post going, “I don’t want to go. I

Meredith Krimmel

Don’t want to go.

Meredith Krimmel

That’s how I feel when I leave. That made me go back to real life. I love camp.

Pat Sorrell

I love that.

Meredith Krimmel

We kind of talked about this a little earlier, but it’s not just life changing for the campers, it’s life changing for everybody involved, the counselors, your counselors and then the partner counselors, someone who’s gone for 15 or 16 summers now for a week, it has impacted my life and the way I view summer camp and the way I view the experience of being independent and away from home. And it makes me see things differently with my own children. My son goes to sleep away camp now and executive functioning is a challenge and the joke is always, “What are they going to have to mail back to us this year?” Last year it was a shoe, a single shoe, but it’s just such an experience. As hard as it is to release the control and let them go and learn, he They do come back taller.

They come back more confident. They come back more independent and to provide an opportunity for any child or young adult to be able to have that experience is just amazing.

Pat Sorrell

So there’s a young man called Sebastian and he was a camper, wheelchair, lots of cognitive challenges. And he became friends with one of our summer staffers. They are like brothers now, and this was years ago. They are the best friends. Sebastian was in his wedding. I mean, these are the bonds that form. And we’re talking just a week, but I mean, or a weekend. I mean, this impacts, as I said, people the rest of their lives. But Sebastian is an amazing young man, despite all of his challenges. His mom’s awesome too, by the way. But he is just a credit to showing the impact of what people can do with their lives with multiple, multiple challenges and moving forward.

Meredith Krimmel

Yeah.

Stephanie Landis

Another random story, but it’s not just your forward facing counselors. Your kitchen staff has actually made a huge impact on our kids here. One year, one of the boys was like, “These are the best croutons ever.” And we went and we found the kitchen staff member, and I wish that I could remember her name, but I’m so bad with names.

Pat Sorrell

Sharon.

Stephanie Landis

Yes, it is Sharon. Love her. She’s amazing. And we found her and he was like, “Man, these are the best. I love your croutons.” Then she was like, “Great.” Not only did she then invite us so that we could go into the kitchen and she step by step showed them how to make the croutons. She sent us home with bags of croutons. And then my children were like, “These are the best croutons.” She remembered the next year, remembered him. His name came out. They knew that it was one of the boys’ birthdays while we were there, made him a birthday cake, cookie cake, and celebrated it. The kitchen staff, you’ve talked about how it’s for children with allergies too. The kitchen staff are fully involved and love these kids and what they do and their job. And we were there for one week and we know that the number of partners that you’ve talked about that have had to have gone through and come in and out.

And we were there in March and a whole year later she’s remembering our kids

And that we loved croutons and going all in on it and just treating each kid with such care blew my mind and was like, these are life … It was life changing for him.

Pat Sorrell

So Sharon, that we are still talking about the croutons. It was very famous. I think I was there that afternoon and Sharon told me all about it. And I’m going to share what y’all said today with her. She’s going through some challenges right now, some health challenges, and this will make her day that y’all brought this up today. She’s

Stephanie Landis

Famous on our campus. She is well loved.

Meredith Krimmel (33:58):

Camp for all food is, it’s really good.

Pat Sorrell

We look at the food program as program. We don’t look at it as just simply providing food for everybody. So we get all those special diets ahead of time and we want a child, again, not to feel different. And so when they go elsewhere, they have to go through the food line, they have to ask questions or they might get something that’s not right for them, the whole thing. At Camp for All, they just ask, give their name and they get their appropriate tray. Some of our camps like with Phenol Ketaturnia, PKU or- We’re there with

Meredith Krimmel

Them.

Pat Sorrell

Oh, you are, that’s right. And or the renal camp that has to do low salt and other things or they have their own lines and we can take care of that. But again, it’s important because part of their camp experience is having the right food so they feel good and can function at their full capacity.

Meredith Krimmel

And as a speech language pathologist, food and eating is such a part of our culture. It’s such a part of our social and community. And I think about this a lot with PKU because we’re there the same week they are. It’s a week where they get to have a very traditional, typical lunch, dinner, breakfast experience with their friends where I think probably in their typical life, it looks a little different because their diet is so restrictive and so unique to them. And our kids too, we have kids with allergies or special diets and when you’re there, you’re just like everyone else. It feels like you’re all going through the line, your line might be different, your tray migh look different, but everybody’s having the same experience and eating together. And it really is so important for the social and community building aspect.

Pat Sorrell

It is. And having the opportunity to experience that and then go home and mom and dad, they see you come home with a whole different outlook and ability. I think it’s critical. It’s critical and it’s important for everybody that comes to camp.

Stephanie Landis

No, I’m glad we did talk about the food because it is a huge worry for a lot of parents when they are sending their kids to a summer camp. And even thinking about the medical side of it, like you said, I personally have having a child that doesn’t have a different diet, wouldn’t have thought about that, but I do have friends that have kids with severe allergies or on very special medical diets. And we’ve sent kids that have very specific medical needs and the parents are always so worried. And we’re like, “No, this place really has you. This kid is going to do very well there.” And they do. And it takes that extra load of worry off of these parents. And

Pat Sorrell

I think that’s some of the hard part about sending your child to camp that has these challenges is you’re on top of them all the time. And how do I release that? How do I have faith in somebody else is going to be able to do that? And that’s why the planning is so important and the communication is so important. So it’s like the camp that we have for children with severe food allergies, the family camp. Their allergies are pretty challenging. I have two grandsons with food allergies and I just, we always have to just think it through all the time. As a parent, you’re even more on top of it, but you just, do I have faith that somebody is going to be serving everybody else food, that they’re going to be taking care of my child? And that’s a leap of faith to send your child there.

But then they come home and go, “Oh, it worked out really

Stephanie Landis

Well.” Yeah. As we wrap up, I do want to ask, what’s your favorite activity?

Pat Sorrell

Oh, that is tough. I have to say the costume closet is near and dear to me because we didn’t have it when I first started at Camp For All. I’ve been at Camp for All 18 years now. And in 2013, we opened Star Place and before that, the costume closet, it was a closet in arts and crafts and it was nasty and only our staff could use it. And so we did the costume room at Star Place and it is just the most magical place for everybody. I was out there for a camp a couple of weeks ago and it started raining.

The Joy School was out there and it started raining. We were out on the challenge course. We all had, the kids were so disappointed. We went inside, we went into Star Place and they were climbing all over everything, just like they were outside. And then I saw people coming out into the gym part with costumes on and I went, “Okay, somebody’s in there having fun too.” It was hysterical. It was a lot of fun. So that’s one of my favorites, but I love the horses too. I don’t know. I think I just love camp for all.

Stephanie Landis

Meredith, what’s your favorite activity?

Meredith Krimmel

Oh, that’s really tough. I love the giant swing. I do. I remember years and years and years ago, we were there on my birthday and I was, “Please, please, please, can I try the giant swing? Please let me try it. ” And they did, and it was so fun. That’s one of my favorites, which is crazy because I’m afraid of heights. I really struggle on the rock wall and the zipline because of my fear of heights, but I have done it, but I would say the giant swing is probably one of my favorites to do, but I love to watch the kids at Star Place Ropes. There are so many parts of that challenge course that you get to see kids overcome fear and push themselves and the staff is so great because they’re up there and they can walk with them or hold their hand or show them how to move on a certain rope.

So that’s probably one of my favorites to watch. What about you?

Stephanie Landis

I love the canoeing. Oh yeah. I don’t know why there’s just something so peaceful about being out on the water and watching these kids and then the like, “Oop, are they going to tip? Are they not? ” But I love being out there on the canoes with the kids, but one of my favorites then to watch is the fishing.

Meredith Krimmel

Fishing.

Stephanie Landis

It’s so funny to watch them fish and how excited they are to catch a fish and then the tradition of kissing a fish before you throw it back and some of them freak out and we’re like, you don’t really, again, have to cash the fish, but it’s just the sense of accomplishment that they get from fishing is just so fun. But you’re right, that challenge course and the inset, it’s super fun to watch. But other than the skits, the canoe and the fishing are one of my favorites. Yeah. Fishing’s always

Meredith Krimmel

Fun.

Pat Sorrell

Tom Brown with the Hamel Foundation was volunteering out at camp with muscular dystrophy years ago and he was fishing with a young man who had muscular dystrophy and the little boy caught a fish and they had such a great time. The next year, he passed away, the little boy passed away and Tom’s tells everybody that Nathan caught the fish, but Nathan caught me.

Meredith Krimmel

Yeah. The fishing is so … There’s a lot of success with fishing and I feel like that’s a place where a lot of kids can grow a lot of confidence. It’s usually something that a lot of kids haven’t done before, so it’s new.

Pat Sorrell

And a lot of fish get caught.

Meredith Krimmel

A lot of fish. A lot of fish get caught. Especially when it’s raining. Yeah. And the turtles, that’s not as … Luckily I haven’t

Stephanie Landis

Caught a turtle yet. Yeah. So you’re

Meredith Krimmel

Supposed to pull your hook out when you see a turtle, but when it’s raining, you’ll catch a lot of fish.

Stephanie Landis

And I learned to use sausage,

Meredith Krimmel

And

Stephanie Landis

Then when I went fishing with my own kids, brought sausage and I was like, “Oh, this is the magic bait.”

Meredith Krimmel

It really is.

Pat Sorrell

It’s a lot of fun. I mean, it’s so hard to say one activity because there’s so many things to do and there’s more things you can do in a week all day long. So that’s the beauty of designing the program before you even get to camp is because you have choices of things you can do. So yeah, it’s a lot of fun.

Stephanie Landis

And it’s amazing to sit there and think of all of these activities and then we’re like, “Oh, they’ve designed it for all kids to be able to go and enjoy.” And as you said, I’ve watched kids who can’t physically climb up the rock wall be able to use a lift and they’ve lifted kids up so they could go up the wall and then they’re still able to go and zip line and have that experience. And so it’s wonderful to see that they feel included and that every kid goes out there and feels like, “I can do all of these things.”

Pat Sorrell

So recently we had our program supervisors look at all the programming and look at what are some things that we’re always looking, how do we take Camp for All to the next level for our campers? And so they came up with a list of, they had to analyze and come up with some new ideas on programming, even out horses, there’s a new trail we’re going to be working on and how do we improve it? How do we make that impact even bigger? And so they had to research the cost, the impact, every ask how many people is it going to take to provide it, all those things. So we’re going to be adding a few new programming too, which will be a lot of fun.

Meredith Krimmel

Oh, that’s exciting. That is exciting. All right.

Stephanie Landis

Well, we could share camp for all stories all day and really have a great time with it, but we want to respect your time. The last question we ask everyone is that if you had one piece of advice and it can be about camp or it could be any advice that you want to give, what would you impart with us?

Pat Sorrell

My advice is that you, when you have something that you’ve really excelled at and you’ve really succeeded at, take that as the initiative to go to the next level. What is it? What more can I do? I love that. Yeah,

Meredith Krimmel

That’s a brand new one and I love it.

Stephanie Landis

It is great. Well, thank you so much for coming and sharing about Camp For All. Hopefully we’ve inspired some families to go out there and get some camp experience for their own young kids and we appreciate speaking with you.

Pat Sorrell

This has been a delight. Thank you both very much.

Stephanie Landis

Thank You.